I interviewed Balbir Mathur, co-founder with his wife Treva, of Trees For Life, in Montreal. Trees for Life is actually based in Wichita and is a non-profit that has planted many millions of fruit trees in India, Africa, South America and other developing countries. We met in Montreal because I thought he might enjoy meeting my friend and mentor Frédéric Back, creator of the film The Man Who Planted Trees. My thought that was since they were both planters of trees they’d relate and something good might evolve out of their meeting. A friendship did between these two highly accomplished, creative but very different men.

In the day before our interview, Balbir repeatedly referred to the help that continually shows up in his work and life. I asked Balbir about that support -- what he knows about it and where it comes from. He started by explaining that he became disenchanted with religion as a young boy. It divides people rather than unites them, he said. Politicians use religious divisions in India and elsewhere to manipulate people and power. This is some of our dialogue on these subjects.

Rod: Do you believe there is a God?

Balbir: Who knows?

Rod: Does that mean no? You do not believe there is a God?

Balbir: I cannot answer your question. I am not in theology. I do not understand those concepts. I do not live in those concepts. I do not worry about what others have to say. I have simplified my life to just three principles, which I try to practice. I cannot say I have mastered them. I attempt. I fall, I falter and I attempt, I attempt.

I serve. I do the dance I must. I plant trees but I am not the doer of this work. I am the facilitator, the instrument. I am one part of the symphony. I know there is an overall scheme to this symphony that I cannot understand. In some way, we are each playing our own part. It is not for me to judge or criticize the life or work of another. All I know is that this is my dance. I would plant trees today even if I knew for a certainty that the world would end tomorrow."

This boat I travel in is called Surrender. I have nothing to achieve. Whatever comes is there and I enjoy it. The two oars that take my boat -- one is instant forgiveness. I get angry, I get mad, but as soon as I remind myself to put my oars in action I forgive. The second oar is tremendous gratitude. I am thankful for the experience of this life, for the opportunity to dance. 

Rod: To what do you surrender?

Balbir: The act of surrendering is so important that who you surrender to becomes insignificant. It is the surrender itself that is important. At different times you surrender to different things. Whatever it is, we will enjoy the moment the way it is. Call it God, call it Spirit, call it the love energy, call it by whatever pigeon hole you want -- but you surrender to life as it is, without demanding anything. If life is the master, I am the dancer. However I can serve, I do serve.

Rod: There seems to be a recognition that there is a spiritual force involved somehow.

Balbir: Yes, but those that experience it need no words and for those that cannot, words will do no good. Why talk about it? Describing light to a blind man will not help the blind man. It is frustrating to put it into words -- like trying to put the dance of a butterfly into words. You can only describe the beauty you see. People who wish to see it will see it. Trying to convert others is a violent act and denies the beauty of the dance.

Rod: How much connection in your life is possible with people who cannot see the beauty? Do you forget about them?

Balbir: No. Oh no. I dance with them just as I dance with those I have a connection with. A man who cuts trees has just as valid an experience as one who plants a tree. The dance, the orchestra of the spirit, needs all instruments, including those who play different tunes. I cannot see the mystery. I cannot see what the Master is doing with the orchestra. I play my instrument as well as I can. I won't let my part in this orchestra fall down. The drums might not sound good to someone playing the piano, but that drum has just as valid a reason in that orchestra as anyone else.

Rod: But some people give you energy and some take it away. How do you relate with people who take it away?

Balbir: There are two aspects -- the physical and spiritual. In the physical realm we have such limited time energy. That is reality. Psychologically you can be friends but lack the time and energy to spend with them. There is no contradiction in that.

You have left one shore and you need all your energy to get to the other side. You need not be dragged behind by the other energy. One day you become a bridge.

 Rod: Do you believe we get help in our work?

Balbir: Not help in my work. My work is dictated. I am a servant. I am not the doer. The moment I become doer, I have failed.

Rod: Do you experience synchronicity in you work?

Balbir: All of the time. Not some of the time -- all of the time.

Rod: How do you raise money? Does that side of Trees For Life take care of itself? Do you ask people for money?

Balbir: I share the information with people as simply as I can, and when it comes, it comes and when it does not come it doesn't come. We are not dependent, we cannot become dependent. We must not ask. We are not beggars.

Money is critical. That is the reality. One cannot be for it or against it, but one has to understand its role. We need money like we need a skin on our body, but my skin is not my soul. The confusion occurs, and it occurred in my life, when money dominates us. (Balbir was, at one time, a successful consultant, negotiating joint ventures between U.S. companies and firms overseas). Once we understand that we can deal with it on a day to day basis.

I do not consider my work to be any more important than any other work or if it does not take place, the world will come to an end. I let people know what we are doing, and then whatever comes is put to use. But we will do irrespective of whether or not there is money.

. . .

I later traveled to Wichita to spend some time with Balbir. One of the more interesting aspects of my visit to Trees for Life is that they gathered each morning for a short silent meditation. That is an interesting way to bring people together psychically so that the work might move forward in a cohesive way, united behind a common mindset.

Balbir’s wife Treva, co-founded Trees For Life and and worked shoulder-to-shoulder with Balbir throughout his decades with the nonprofit. She wrote in Lifelines, the Trees for Life newsletter, that nothing important comes without sacrifice.

Three years ago Balbir (Mathur) and I were in a small village in Orissa, India. The villagers welcomed us with songs and flower garlands. After introductions, the village leaders sat down with us. Our land is very degraded and we are very poor, they said. If our children were educated they could get jobs, but there is not enough money for their school. It's like a trap, and we can't break free. What can we do?

         Balbir closed his eyes, listening intently with great reverence. Then he spoke.

If you will donate some very poor land to your school, we can help you regenerate that land, and it can provide income for the school, he said.

Several villagers started grumbling. Our lands have been divided and passed down for generations, they argued. How could our people give up their inheritance?

         Balbir spread his bands. Noth­ing comes without sacrifice. The more important the task, the greater the sacrifice.

         - Treva Mathur, in LifeLines, the newsletter of Trees For Life.

After reading that article, I called Balbir, Treva’s husband, and asked him about sacrifice. This is what he said.

From time immemorial, spiritual leaders of all faiths have told us that anything worthwhile requires a sacrifice. Nothing happens without a sacrifice. Sacrifice is such an essential part of the equation of life. In order for a mother to give birth to a child, she has to sacrifice. A sperm germinates an egg, it has to lose its identity. A seed, to grow, has to lose itself. A candle can only give light if it burns itself out.

The act of religious fasting, by its very act, acquires sacredness. Sacrifice is the cornerstone of life. When we say that life is sacred, that implies that it demands sacrifice. Sacrifice is the core of sacredness. What we sacrifice is what becomes sacred to us. Without sacrifice, nothing becomes sacred.

. . . 

Faith is the opening of all sides and every level of one's life to the divine inflow. 
- Martin Luther King, Jr.

Faith is not being sure. It is not being sure, but betting with your last cent.
- Mary Jean Iron

Faith is always an adventure.  
- Elsie Chamberlain